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post #1 of 34 Old 12-24-2010, 01:59 AM Thread Starter
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HID experiments & how-to

Finally I've been able to have some fully reliable non blinding HID's on my Compass head lights. I've been working on this since 3 months to finally come up with the final result. I've made a PDF to download and I'll post pics tomorrow.

http://www.freewebs.com/hidtr/HID-how-to.pdf


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post #2 of 34 Old 12-24-2010, 07:01 AM
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Awesome! thanks for putting that all together.


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post #3 of 34 Old 12-24-2010, 02:43 PM
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Very nice mowgli, thanks for taking the time to put that together, reps to ya when I can again!

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post #4 of 34 Old 12-24-2010, 03:24 PM Thread Starter
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I've added pictures of the installation in the PDF and here are some daytime pictures :

(6000k heads & 30000k fogs)







I'll take some night shots tonight!


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post #5 of 34 Old 12-25-2010, 12:19 PM
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Nice pics! What's all that white stuff lol!

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post #6 of 34 Old 12-30-2010, 01:41 AM Thread Starter
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post #7 of 34 Old 12-30-2010, 03:45 AM
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Nice shot, the night pic really tells the story!

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post #8 of 34 Old 03-08-2011, 03:15 AM Thread Starter
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Update : I really suggest you add some capacitors to your installation.


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post #9 of 34 Old 05-29-2011, 07:39 PM
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Did one of you tried a 55w HID kit? logically, these kits should not cause any flickering because there are the same as the halogen 55w filament bulbs. I' thinking about buying a single beam kit from eBay, not vvme because they don't have the new slim digital ballasts, but some from china.

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post #10 of 34 Old 05-30-2011, 06:05 PM Thread Starter
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Did one of you tried a 55w HID kit? logically, these kits should not cause any flickering because there are the same as the halogen 55w filament bulbs. I' thinking about buying a single beam kit from eBay, not vvme because they don't have the new slim digital ballasts, but some from china.
I don't think you should put a 55W HID kit on your Jeep. 55W on reflector lights will blind other people. Plus, it's not really a question of power. Yes 55W is the power of the standard halogen bulb but a ballast draws 5.8A on the start up and 3.4A when it's stable. So these are not standard current values on a halogen bulb.


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post #11 of 34 Old 05-31-2011, 02:45 AM
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I finally decided to buy a Canbus compatible 35 W single beam HID kit on eBay. Slim ballast, genuine german Hylux ballast asic chip, they told me they are compatible with our computers and will not flicker. 30 days money back... I will buy and let you know! $85 shipped, I think it's a steal. I'm thinking about 6000K, that what I had in my previous car and liked the color, not too flashy.

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

By the way mowgli, where did you put the ballasts for the HID in the fogs?

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post #12 of 34 Old 06-02-2011, 01:21 PM Thread Starter
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I never tried canbus ballasts but it's just a regular ballast with a capacitor added inside. It should work.

I put ballasts for the fogs on a metal beam under the radiator or I stick them direclty on the inside of the bumper. I use 3M double sided tape to install all my ballasts. Once the surface is clean, it should stay in place forever!


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post #13 of 34 Old 06-15-2011, 04:01 AM
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It was too good to be true... I ordered the Canbus ballasts HID kit and finally it 's not 100% working, gives the same results as your setup #3... It was really nice because the bulbs have an halogen high beam on them so both DRL & high beams (halogen, not HID) were still working. Once in a while they both "slowly" turn on & off randomly not together so it looks really stupid. I am thinking about adding a relay & fuse harness that I have from an old fog light kit so that low beam would be powered directly from the battery (using relay) but keeping the high beam & ground connected on oem plugs. I will try it out in the next days and let you know!

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post #14 of 34 Old 06-15-2011, 01:00 PM Thread Starter
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Damn that sucks! Anyone installing HID's on a Compass 1st gen should put a single beam kit. Anyways a halogen bulb placed on top like yours and a bi-xenon bulb doesn't really make a good high beam. A HID low beam is enough.


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post #15 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 05:15 AM
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Yeah!! With a bit more money and most of all some free time, I was finally able to install my HID kit and it's 100% working, no flickers or anything. Thanks to mowgli for all the ideas... I made my own relay harness (cost was about $10) and my kit came with halogen high beam so I connected it and the ground on the oem 9008 plugs from the Compass, then for the HID low beams I used a connection with a 40A relay & activation on the low beam from the oem plug on the left side. I know the halogen high beams sucks but at least I'm legal because I still have DRL that are mandatory here in Quebec and functional high beams...

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post #16 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 12:24 PM Thread Starter
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Good to hear!
I'm still legal too because I've put my DRL on something else so I still have some. And I have now a dimming HID kit which can go from 35W to 55W so I can have high beam. And when I start my off road HID lights, it's insane!


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post #17 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by flipper View Post
Yeah!! With a bit more money and most of all some free time, I was finally able to install my HID kit and it's 100% working, no flickers or anything. Thanks to mowgli for all the ideas... I made my own relay harness (cost was about $10) and my kit came with halogen high beam so I connected it and the ground on the oem 9008 plugs from the Compass, then for the HID low beams I used a connection with a 40A relay & activation on the low beam from the oem plug on the left side. I know the halogen high beams sucks but at least I'm legal because I still have DRL that are mandatory here in Quebec and functional high beams...
no, you're not. HID conversion kits themselves are illegal. nice try though
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post #18 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 05:16 PM Thread Starter
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no, you're not. HID conversion kits themselves are illegal. nice try though
And why is it illegal my friend?


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post #19 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 05:49 PM
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And why is it illegal my friend?
all HID retrofit kits are against the law, both in Canada and the US. they emit an illegal beam pattern, and are outside the legal color spectrum.

and please, do not reply with "but mine don't glare, i aimed them down," "no one has ever flashed me before," or "i had my buddy drive at me, he said they were fine." i've heard it all before. trust me when i say i know what i'm talking about.
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post #20 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 05:57 PM Thread Starter
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all HID retrofit kits are against the law, both in Canada and the US. they emit an illegal beam pattern, and are outside the legal color spectrum.

and please, do not reply with "but mine don't glare, i aimed them down," "no one has ever flashed me before," or "i had my buddy drive at me, he said they were fine." i've heard it all before. trust me when i say i know what i'm talking about.
I could tell all the sentences you said and this would be true but I will only tell you that I live in Quebec and I have an official car modification guide released by the police and there is no law in Quebec that is against HID's. You have to respect the color but 4300k, 6000k and 8000k respect the color. So I think I know what I'm talking about too my friend! But I'm talking about Quebec, nowhere else.


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post #21 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 06:06 PM
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I could tell all the sentences you said and this would be true but I will only tell you that I live in Quebec and I have an official car modification guide released by the police and there is no law in Quebec that is against HID's. You have to respect the color but 4300k, 6000k and 8000k respect the color. So I think I know what I'm talking about too my friend! But I'm talking about Quebec, nowhere else.
sorry, they're illegal in canada too

Daniel Stern Lighting Consultancy and Supply

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Originally Posted by Daniel Stern Lighting
...What about the law, what does it have to say on the matter? In virtually every first-world country, HID "retrofits" into halogen headlamps are illegal. They're illegal clear across Europe and in all of the many countries that use European ECE headlight regulations. They're illegal in the US and Canada. Some people dismiss this because North American regulations, in particular, are written in such a manner as to reject a great many genuinely good headlamps. Nevertheless, on the particular count of HID "retrofits" into halogen headlamps, the world's regulators and engineers all say DON'T...
and even though it specifies the US, here is a page from Hella saying how people take their products and modify them and resell them, and how unsafe and illegal they are (again, they specify only in the US, but they are also illegal in Canada). i'm not trying to tell anyone what to do, just throwing the propor information out there. they are illegal and unsafe.

http://www.hella.com/produktion/Hell...d_Approved.jsp

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post #22 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 06:13 PM Thread Starter
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sorry, they're illegal in canada too

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I don't care whatever article you throw like this. I have an official document and it is not written that HID's are illegal in Quebec.

And I think that with my company I am in a good position to talk about HID's because I've seen many and many different cars. I have to tell that bi-xenon HID's produce illegal pattern and also some bulbs that use spacers. But direct fit/bolt-on bulbs produce exactly the same pattern than an halogen bulb. You're proving your point with articles made by mr. Nobody, I'm proving my point with an official document and my experience with 30 HID kits. I don't see any point on arguing with you much.


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post #23 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 07:14 PM
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Hmmm, this conversation with IRSmart seems awfully familiar... ~~~(flashback sequence to http://www.myjeepcompass.com/forums/...version-3.html)~~~

Bottom line is this: There are laws about different things in different places. Many are open to interpretation and most are not reinforced. If you really want to get down to it, 99% of people that drive do something illegal every day, whether it is not coming to a complete stop at a stop sign, running a red light, not using their turn signal, not yielding properly, no lights in bad weather, etc. Sometimes, believe it or not, laws can conflict with themselves in some form or another.

If Mowgli wants to drive around with HID's in a housing not ordinarily meant for them, fine. If the law says HID's are illegal or not in Quebec, fine. If he has an official document that says nothing about them being illegal, fine. If a Bulldog wants to mate with a Schih Tzu, fine.

Your point has been made (several times) and I think that most people are aware that HID's are illegal in many areas. It is up to each individual if they want to take the chance or not. I personally don't see a reason to bring something up and harp on it if it does not directly affect my life and it brings someone else joy in their life...

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post #24 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 07:42 PM
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I don't care whatever article you throw like this. I have an official document and it is not written that HID's are illegal in Quebec.

And I think that with my company I am in a good position to talk about HID's because I've seen many and many different cars. I have to tell that bi-xenon HID's produce illegal pattern and also some bulbs that use spacers. But direct fit/bolt-on bulbs produce exactly the same pattern than an halogen bulb. You're proving your point with articles made by mr. Nobody, I'm proving my point with an official document and my experience with 30 HID kits. I don't see any point on arguing with you much.
does your document specifically say that putting in an HID retrofit kit is legal, or does it simply not mention that putting them in is illegal? that's a big difference.

but a direct, bolt-in HID bulb does not produce the same beam pattern as a hallogen bulb. it's geometry, it is impossible to have the same beam pattern when the location of the light source changes inside the focal point, which is the case with a hallogen to HID conversion.

if you don't trust "mr. nobody," hear it from the United States National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

Mr. Jeff Deetz, Sales Manager, Santeca Electronics, Inc., 7215 East 21<sup>st</sup> Street, Suite D, Indianapolis, IN 46219
Mr. Simon S. Shih, 4 Teal, Irvine, CA* 92604
Mr. Song M. Kim, C.M.O./Fanteks, Inc., 580 Sylvan Ave., Suite 1A, Englewood Cliffs, NJ* 07632

or how about official documents from the United States Department of Transportation, showing the different categories that the kits failed in? in these examples, the DOT used "bolt-in" HID kits. wait...i thought that if you got bolt-in kits, the beam pattern is "exactly the same." why is the beam pattern drastically different, each out of the three times it is tested? it's because an HID bulb's arc-style light source is in a different location than a hallogen's filament.

http://dastern.torque.net/techdocs/H..._HID_Retro.pdf
http://dastern.torque.net/techdocs/H..._HID_Retro.pdf
http://dastern.torque.net/techdocs/H...ID_Retro_a.pdf

like i said last time, yes, the laws are different everywhere. but the bottom line is, HID kits are illegal (in both the US and Canada), unsafe, and unreliable. with that said, i am not going to come to any of your houses and make you remove them, i'm not going to flame anyone for having them, nor will i ever ask anyone to remove them. i am simply in the business is spreading correct information, in the hopes that someone will use that information for good. but i will not be told that i am wrong, because i'm not. my claims have a backup based in science, and proof showing both the fact that they are illegal, and scientific evidence showing why

Last edited by IRSmart; 06-22-2011 at 08:07 PM.
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post #25 of 34 Old 06-22-2011, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by BlackNightling View Post
Hmmm, this conversation with IRSmart seems awfully familiar... ~~~(flashback sequence to http://www.myjeepcompass.com/forums/...version-3.html)~~~

Bottom line is this: There are laws about different things in different places. Many are open to interpretation and most are not reinforced. If you really want to get down to it, 99% of people that drive do something illegal every day, whether it is not coming to a complete stop at a stop sign, running a red light, not using their turn signal, not yielding properly, no lights in bad weather, etc. Sometimes, believe it or not, laws can conflict with themselves in some form or another.

If Mowgli wants to drive around with HID's in a housing not ordinarily meant for them, fine. If the law says HID's are illegal or not in Quebec, fine. If he has an official document that says nothing about them being illegal, fine. If a Bulldog wants to mate with a Schih Tzu, fine.

Your point has been made (several times) and I think that most people are aware that HID's are illegal in many areas. It is up to each individual if they want to take the chance or not. I personally don't see a reason to bring something up and harp on it if it does not directly affect my life and it brings someone else joy in their life...
i agree with everything you've said. he can do as he wishes. i am not trying to tell anyone what to do. i didn't even really bring it up, i was simply correcting the poster that said his car was illegal. when asked why, i explained why. i was then told i was wrong, to which i defended my answer. that's all. everyone here is free to do as they wish, but at least they will do so informed.
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post #26 of 34 Old 06-24-2011, 05:41 PM
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Wow, sorry for starting all that discussion about legallity... I know adding HID to regular headlights made for halogen are not 100% legal but I know police will tolerate them in Quebec. When I say that I am legal, I meant that I still have DRL & some sort of high beams in case of an inspection, I think it's more legal than killing those 2 functions. My 2 cents!

I am so happy, the light output is so much better and it looks great! Don't care about how much annoying it is for other drivers, I see better.

Advise from me: Don't buy those CANBUS compatible ballasts, it's B.S. You will need an installation with Relay harness anyway on the Jeep.

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post #27 of 34 Old 06-25-2011, 01:56 AM
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Wow, sorry for starting all that discussion about legallity... I know adding HID to regular headlights made for halogen are not 100% legal but I know police will tolerate them in Quebec. When I say that I am legal, I meant that I still have DRL & some sort of high beams in case of an inspection, I think it's more legal than killing those 2 functions. My 2 cents!

I am so happy, the light output is so much better and it looks great! Don't care about how much annoying it is for other drivers, I see better.
Advise from me: Don't buy those CANBUS compatible ballasts, it's B.S. You will need an installation with Relay harness anyway on the Jeep.
the light output isn't better, it's scattered like crazy, hense the legality. and your lack of concern about other people is a little disturbing
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post #28 of 34 Old 06-25-2011, 11:42 PM Thread Starter
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the light output isn't better, it's scattered like crazy, hense the legality. and your lack of concern about other people is a little disturbing
Yeah I think everybody should care a bit about the other drivers but hell yeah the light output is better. With my offroad lights, I see at about 1km and I don't think halogen bulbs can't ever do this. I think you never tried HID's or you absolutely don't know what you are talking about.


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post #29 of 34 Old 06-26-2011, 02:02 AM
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Yeah I think everybody should care a bit about the other drivers but hell yeah the light output is better. With my offroad lights, I see at about 1km and I don't think halogen bulbs can't ever do this. I think you never tried HID's or you absolutely don't know what you are talking about.
actually, i have tried them. i put them in my mustang (the correct way, with projectors) but i didn't like them and i took them out. and with all due respect, i've backed my claims up with links showing scientific evidence that proves what i'm trying to say. how can you claim i don't know what i'm talking about?
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post #30 of 34 Old 06-26-2011, 02:47 AM Thread Starter
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If it is really illegal why do thousand of people run them in Canada and the police don't do a thing? I've never heard anyone doing an accident and said that he was blind by HID lights.

If it is really crap, why do cars come with factory HID's? Oh yeah it's supposed to be out of the legal color but it is 4300k and aftermarket HID's can be sold in 4300k.

I think you stick too much to your articles and your one-time experience. I didn't have a great experience with HID's when I tried bi-xenon on my Compass neither. But single beam is perfect, you cannot say it is all crap, it is not all crap because we would not have so many cars with HID's on our roads.


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