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Discussion Starter #21
I think the biggest we have heard of here without a lift is the 235/65R17, probably with 1.25" spacers, but I cannot confirm any of that would need to dig through the forum and do some googling. I have it stuck in my head that everyone has maxed out around 29" tall and 9.5" wide, and it seems like the spacers have been the make-or-break key but the smaller lifts still help clearance for mud and snow/ice that can build up in the fenderwells. Like I said, would need to do some digging to see what others have claimed worked for them.
That sounds reasonable to me. So, think it's fairly safe to say spacers and a 235/65/17's would be a good bet. When I get some time, going to take a trip to see my tire guy. Just want to see the difference in width between the 225's and the 235's.

I say claimed because there are a lot of people out there who live in denial. They want to make something work through sheer willpower, so they will come on here and be like "eyyyy I fut sum 255/55R18 on muy 2018 sport, kno rubbin at all!"
Quoted for truth right here!!! LOL!! You're absolutely correct. I'm reminded of that old commercial that says...."They can't put anything on the internet that's not true!"

Take two grains for anything I say, I'm still rolling on my original stock tires and wheels and have never tried any of it myself so far.
Still though, your aproach to the topic at hand seems very straightforward and logic based. Cheers!

At the same time, there's this nagging little part of me that wonders if I should have just have bought a damn Wrangler!
 

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Discussion Starter #22
As a side note, been kind of looking at Wranglers. The one thing that really holds me back from pulling the trigger is the lack of options...My Trailhawk is pretty much fully loaded. I also acknowledge that it's kind of like comparing apples and oranges.

Looked at a bunch of used ones. A lot of them don't even come standard with power windows or blue tooth. Yes, I admit it, I like all the infotainment gadgetry!
 

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bluestar said:
there's this nagging little part of me that wonders if I should have just have bought a damn Wrangler!
My wife and I have similar thoughts and discussions all the time. We max out our Compass' capabilities regularly. Sometimes its being used like a truck, towing right at the limits. Sometimes we venture off the pavement and have to use 100% of our ground clearance and crawl super carefully to avoid damage or getting stuck. Sometimes we get a big drop of snow overnight in the winter and we just barely manage to get around (this has been an issue of the low profile street tires they send on the limited trim, switching to better tires and rims this winter). When we go camping or adventuring we often run out of cargo space and so we invested in both a rear cargo rack and a thule roof box.

A lot of times when we are at those limits we talk about how a truck would be serving us slightly better at that particular moment, or a larger more powerful SUV such as the grand cherokee. No doubt the Jeep gladiator would knock it out of the park now that it has arrived as an option. But we enjoy a lot of benefits in our Compass as well.

For one thing, the price was way better. We did battle with the dealership until we got the price under $27k for a very well equipped limited trim, and this was late 2017 when these things were first hitting the showrooms. Anything else we look at that we deem "better" is creeping into the 40k+ range, so the value alone is pretty darn high.

Beyond that, it still has to function as a daily driver and for that it sips fuel slowly and provides a heck of a lot of creature comforts. Can't beat that heated wheel and the heated seats with remote start in the winter.

It's really stylish, and when we need it to go above the normal call of duty for towing or adventuring (or both) it steps up to the plate and gets the job done. Not as gracefully as a bigger truck or SUV, not as easily with having to shift it manually in certain situations and having to add the cargo box for certain trips and such, but it always gets the job done and it does it at a bargain, relatively speaking.

A lot of the fancy tech stuff doesn't work as flawlessly as I would like. As a poor-man's land rover it lives up to "you get what you pay for". It's not perfect, but its still our favorite car and probably the best one we've ever been able to afford.

The value for the money is the reason we will probably keep it long-term. Its just too expensive to upgrade to anything that ticks off the last few boxes or slightly improves the areas where we max out.
 

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Sweet Jesus how do you push the wheels down, when you put a spacer in between the strut and the body it lifts the body up and who would have thought that the CV shaft "Might" hit the strut with the sway bar disconnected with flex and only when its disconnected :think:

This weekend I (re)watched the install videos for both the teraflex and the daystar kit, and went over the parts lists. I was doing this because the Teraflex kit is pretty cheap on amazon right now, only $310, so I was looking it over pretty close (but ultimately did not buy).

Now for both of these kits, you are definitely running the front CV joints at a harsher angle. The kits drop the rear subframe, but not the front subframe. You basically get nothing but strut spacers in the front, which means your front wheels are dropping relative to the transaxle and therefor those axles are increasing their angle. If you need more proof, just look at step 10 in the Teraflex instructions, which actually have you CUT a chunk of metal off of your front struts to avoid it kissing the CV axle at full flex (with the swaybars disconnected).

Both of these kits are essentially hybrid lifts. The front portion I would call a true "suspension lift" because it DOES push down the front wheels, and nothing else. The oil pan and transmission go UP with the rest of the body, therefor suspension lift. Now in the back, they are putting spacers underneath the entire subframe so your rear diff lowers WITH your wheels and this portion I would call a "body lift" because the rear diff gains no extra clearance. It does keep the rear CV joints running at their original angle.

No subframe spacers in the front means CVs run at increased angle means those parts are at risk for increased wear and shortened life, period.

Its pretty clear these budget lifts are more for cosmetics than seriously helping you clear more obstacles (which is in keeping with the car itself I'd say, since it is a glorified car..) Otherwise they wouldn't drop the rear diff down and leave it in harms way. I wonder if its really necessary to do the spacers on the rear subframe. I mean, if its somewhat ok to run the front ones at more angle why not do the same with the rear? Keep that diff tucked up, right? Especially if you are only talking 1.5 inch or something, once you get to 2" or beyond obviously you are changing the CV angle quite a bit.

We know that the same tires fit either way, just above is one of many examples of people running a 29" tire with no lift. Its really only spacers you need to get to 29", but a little more wheel well clearance would be good still.

Its interesting stuff but it clearly doesn't amount to much. At least the price reflects that. Its all for fun anyways right but fun isn't in my current forecast. I probably get to spend $310 on stain for the house instead, it sounds like.
 

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Discussion Starter #26
My wife and I have similar thoughts and discussions all the time. We max out our Compass' capabilities regularly. Sometimes its being used like a truck, towing right at the limits. Sometimes we venture off the pavement and have to use 100% of our ground clearance and crawl super carefully to avoid damage or getting stuck. Sometimes we get a big drop of snow overnight in the winter and we just barely manage to get around (this has been an issue of the low profile street tires they send on the limited trim, switching to better tires and rims this winter). When we go camping or adventuring we often run out of cargo space and so we invested in both a rear cargo rack and a thule roof box.
That really seems to be the conundrum, should we have bought Wranglers! LOL! For my specific situation, I needed a proper winter vehicle. Living in the Midwest the winters and snow can be brutal. Not really looking for off road trail running, just something to tear through the snow. A have a 2018 Mustang GT that, at this point, has taken on a life of it's own. That's my money pit and obviously something I can't and won't drive through the winter. As another consideration, I'll be retiring from the job in just over three years. My wife and I are planning on relocating to Florida. (Her folks are out there in a suburb of Orlando.) For that I want a vehicle that doesn't sit low to the ground. I've driven through some flooded streets out there and know it can get bad. There's also a part of me that likes the limitless supply of parts available for the Wrangler. You can basically build one from the ground up. So, at this point, we'll see how it goes.

Beyond that, it still has to function as a daily driver and for that it sips fuel slowly and provides a heck of a lot of creature comforts. Can't beat that heated wheel and the heated seats with remote start in the winter.
I love the heated seats and steering wheel! Also really like the remote start, navigation, and panoramic roof!

Here's a quick pic of the money pit! LOL
 

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84z28 said:
Sweet Jesus how do you push the wheels down, when you put a spacer in between the strut and the body it lifts the body up and who would have thought that the CV shaft "Might" hit the strut with the sway bar disconnected with flex and only when its disconnected
Well I'm not trying to piss you off I know I'm not articulating what I mean very well through the text, I'm just saying if there are no spacers for the front subframe and the engine and transmission are mounted to that subframe, then the engine and the transmission don't move from their original location, so the spot where the axles come out of the transmission is the same, yes? And then you put spacers on the front struts so they move down relative to the body and the transmission and the front axles have to follow that so... ?

I really don't know that it would be enough to bother with a 1.5 or 2" kit. Some of those heavy trailers I have put on have squatted the rear end at least 1.5" and brought the front up by about the same amount, no CV joints exploded yet and I've done at least 5 or 6k miles of that kind of towing. Is it the difference of whether the CV joints make it 150k miles vs 200k miles? Because even I don't care much at that point. Maybe these are made way better than the ones chevy used on the old Blazers. I really think there is a case for skipping the spacers for the rear subframe. Why drop the diff back into harms way? Just leave it up and let the axles run at some angle like the front ones have to.

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bluestar said:
I needed a proper winter vehicle
I think the Compass fits the bill. Its not like a Wrangler is well insulated, hard top or soft. The super short wheelbase of the (2 door) wrangler reportedly makes them super squirley to handle on the road on ice. There is what, 18 or 19 inches of advertised water fording capability for the Compass? It keeps up with a wrangler just fine until you hit mud or rocks.

Hey total gear shift you should do a short video of the flowmaster, curious to know what that sounds like. Also would be interested in a review of how the pirelli scorpions do on snow.
 

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Discussion Starter #28
I think the Compass fits the bill. Its not like a Wrangler is well insulated, hard top or soft. The super short wheelbase of the (2 door) wrangler reportedly makes them super squirley to handle on the road on ice. There is what, 18 or 19 inches of advertised water fording capability for the Compass? It keeps up with a wrangler just fine until you hit mud or rocks.

Hey total gear shift you should do a short video of the flowmaster, curious to know what that sounds like. Also would be interested in a review of how the pirelli scorpions do on snow.
Purchased my TH in Dec of last year. Bought used with 30K. Honestly had no complaints in the winter. Pretty much went through everything with ease. The Pirellis were fantastic in the snow. Not really any noticeable road noise and performs very well in the rain. Was kinda wishing some of the snow would have been deeper! LOL

The Flowmaster muffler was a bit disappointing. I Didn't expect it to sound like a V8, has a little deeper tone. Not really a good sound. I'll try to get a vid posted later. Until, here's a pic of my Jeep.
 

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That looks good. I think eventually we would like to have those exact tires on the 17 inch set of TH rims I bought from jim10. They don't make a workable size of the scorpions for our 18 inch rims so I think I am going to end up with some goodyear assurance weatherreadys on that set. Should be a good all-around tire for everything except the most extreme parts of winter and trails.

Thats all a long ways off though, the factory wildpeaks on the 17" set are hardly used and we are cheap, so I plan to run those upwards of a couple years until they are wore out. I'm not jazzed to be putting 215 width tires on but I'll get over it. I think 225 is about perfect for this buggy for the way we use it. 215 is probably going to do better in the winter but I expect the on-road handling to suffer a little and I just don't like that skinny tire look as much. 235 would definitely look the best but looks aren't everything, the wider you go the more you lose MPG and snow/ice performance, then add "taller" to the mix factoring in the perceived power loss and clearance issues and its just too much headache (I'm averse to putting spacers on or seeking aftermarket rims with different offset).

I actually like the stock exhaust system, it makes enough quiet growl to make me happy without being obnoxious, and it doesn't loudly announce to the cars around me when I am blasting 5k RPMs just to try to keep up with the minivans that are leaving the stoplight with me (dodge caravans are quick!). With the multi-air the cold starts actually sound pretty high-performance to me, but once warmed up its pretty much silent and thats ok too.
 

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Discussion Starter #30
That looks good. I think eventually we would like to have those exact tires on the 17 inch set of TH rims I bought from jim10. They don't make a workable size of the scorpions for our 18 inch rims so I think I am going to end up with some goodyear assurance weatherreadys on that set. Should be a good all-around tire for everything except the most extreme parts of winter and trails.
Thanks. I think the TH rims are pretty decent looking. You'll be really happy with the upgrade.

Thats all a long ways off though, the factory wildpeaks on the 17" set are hardly used and we are cheap, so I plan to run those upwards of a couple years until they are wore out. I'm not jazzed to be putting 215 width tires on but I'll get over it. I think 225 is about perfect for this buggy for the way we use it. 215 is probably going to do better in the winter but I expect the on-road handling to suffer a little and I just don't like that skinny tire look as much. 235 would definitely look the best but looks aren't everything, the wider you go the more you lose MPG and snow/ice performance, then add "taller" to the mix factoring in the perceived power loss and clearance issues and its just too much headache (I'm averse to putting spacers on or seeking aftermarket rims with different offset).

In all honesty....I'm leaning towards going with a Wrangler. Didn't mention this before as it wasn't really pertinent to the conversation, but getting a rough shift that's not gone away. I've had it at the dealer twice and they've done a several software updates but it still hasn't fixed the problem. I know the nine speed trans can be problematic and difficult to diagnose. For me, this is just another reason to make the switch. At the end of the day, this is my second car/winter driver. The Mustang is my main focus.

I actually like the stock exhaust system, it makes enough quiet growl to make me happy without being obnoxious, and it doesn't loudly announce to the cars around me when I am blasting 5k RPMs just to try to keep up with the minivans that are leaving the stoplight with me (dodge caravans are quick!). With the multi-air the cold starts actually sound pretty high-performance to me, but once warmed up its pretty much silent and thats ok too.
I kinda like it loud! LOL The Mustang is "wake the dead loud!" I've got Pypes Long Tube Headers, high flow cats, X pipe/Magnaflow Bullet Mufflers, and an MBRP muffler delete axle back. Not to mention CAI and dyno tune! My neighbors hate me! LOL!!!!
 

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Have you ever pondered that the subframe in the front doesnt need to be dropped and a spacer added as there is no need to since you can do it with just the spacer for the strut eliminating extra and unneeded cost. Since you're still just moving the body up then this is still not a problem and again the only reason that you have to cut the strut is because the kit comes with quick disconnect links in which you can disconnect them for off road situations where you want more body roll and articulation for off road. The strut will never come in contact with any other components in normal operations with the link attached

Well I'm not trying to piss you off I know I'm not articulating what I mean very well through the text, I'm just saying if there are no spacers for the front subframe and the engine and transmission are mounted to that subframe, then the engine and the transmission don't move from their original location, so the spot where the axles come out of the transmission is the same, yes? And then you put spacers on the front struts so they move down relative to the body and the transmission and the front axles have to follow that so... ?
 

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84z28 said:
Have you ever pondered that the subframe in the front doesnt need to be dropped
Well I think it really depends on how much of a spacer you are adding to the struts. The taller spacer you put on the struts (without changing anything else) the more angle the CV axles have to run at (all the time) to get "down" to where you have pushed the wheels from the body. For a 1 inch, or 1.5 inch, even a 1 & 5/8" I don't think its any problem. Bilstein currently makes a set of replacement struts for the Renegade that are 1" longer than stock that provides the same overall effect (I'm hoping they will come out with those for the Compass soon, its a way better route than spacers).

Now I think once you get to a 2" spacer, you've likely reached or started to exceed the limit of how much extra angle you can add to the CV axles and still expect any kind of longevity from them. Harsher angles cause CV joints to wear faster, this is really well known and I don't need to explain why because you can google it really easily.

You can also "preview" the effect really easily at home. Take your floor jack and a tape measure, go look at the current angle of the front CVs and keep that angle in your head, now use your jack to lift on the subframe about 2 inches. Now look at the axle again and note the increased angle. This is the extra angle you will have forced it to run at all the time on the road. This is an angle that is not the angle the engineers intended for it to run at and meet its longevity goals. Crank the jack up some more if you want to see the effect exaggerated.

A little bit probably won't make a huge difference. 2+ inches, it might, and that's all I'm saying. You should be conscious of the potential side effects of this. Replacing CVs isn't a huge deal, kinda spendy, might be worth it, its just something to be aware of.

If and when Bilstein releases the 1" longer struts for the Compass, I think that would be the best and most ideal route. No goofy spacers to create a new point for issues to occur between the body and strut contact. The Renegade folks say it fixes the clearance issue at the bottom of the strut tower. Rear diff stays in its original tucked up location. You end up maxing out at the same 29" tire no matter what, so who cars about the difference of 1" or 2"? (Thats a good setup for a joke right there...)

You have to do the crazy 4" lift to get into 30" tire land so, might as well play it slightly safer (in my opinion) and stick to around 1", hopefully gained from strut length.

But like I always say, its a free country so anybody who wants to jam those spacers in I say have fun!
 

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Once you realize the wheels are static and you're put a spacer on top of the strut to move the body up youll be alright

Well I think it really depends on how much of a spacer you are adding to the struts. The taller spacer you put on the struts (without changing anything else) the more angle the CV axles have to run at (all the time) to get "down" to where you have pushed the wheels from the body. For a 1 inch, or 1.5 inch, even a 1 & 5/8" I don't think its any problem. Bilstein currently makes a set of replacement struts for the Renegade that are 1" longer than stock that provides the same overall effect (I'm hoping they will come out with those for the Compass soon, its a way better route than spacers).

Now I think once you get to a 2" spacer, you've likely reached or started to exceed the limit of how much extra angle you can add to the CV axles and still expect any kind of longevity from them. Harsher angles cause CV joints to wear faster, this is really well known and I don't need to explain why because you can google it really easily.

You can also "preview" the effect really easily at home. Take your floor jack and a tape measure, go look at the current angle of the front CVs and keep that angle in your head, now use your jack to lift on the subframe about 2 inches. Now look at the axle again and note the increased angle. This is the extra angle you will have forced it to run at all the time on the road. This is an angle that is not the angle the engineers intended for it to run at and meet its longevity goals. Crank the jack up some more if you want to see the effect exaggerated.

A little bit probably won't make a huge difference. 2+ inches, it might, and that's all I'm saying. You should be conscious of the potential side effects of this. Replacing CVs isn't a huge deal, kinda spendy, might be worth it, its just something to be aware of.

If and when Bilstein releases the 1" longer struts for the Compass, I think that would be the best and most ideal route. No goofy spacers to create a new point for issues to occur between the body and strut contact. The Renegade folks say it fixes the clearance issue at the bottom of the strut tower. Rear diff stays in its original tucked up location. You end up maxing out at the same 29" tire no matter what, so who cars about the difference of 1" or 2"? (Thats a good setup for a joke right there...)

You have to do the crazy 4" lift to get into 30" tire land so, might as well play it slightly safer (in my opinion) and stick to around 1", hopefully gained from strut length.

But like I always say, its a free country so anybody who wants to jam those spacers in I say have fun!
 

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84z28 said:
Once you realize the wheels are static and you're put a spacer on top of the strut to move the body up youll be alright
Again, I think you are just getting hung up on the way I am (failing) to describe what I mean, but just because I can't explain it in a way you understand doesn't mean I'm wrong.

I'll try not to use wording like "Pushing the wheels down". Lets try it this way, the body and the wheels are being pushed apart. Yes? We all agree? Whether you look at it as the wheels going down (my view) or the body going up (your view), we can agree that is what is happening because of the spacer.

So once YOU "realize" that the engine and transmission are staying with the body (which, as we said, is moving away from the wheels), you'll understand that the inside ends of the CV axles coming out of the transmission are also moving away from the wheels and this means the angle of the CVs has permanently increased(!)



 

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Discussion Starter #38
Looks nice! Bummer to see ya go but I'm sure you'll enjoy it!
Thanks! I hope this thread at least offered some insight into installing a lift on the Compass.smile:
 

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Don't have the Daystar 1.5" lift, but I have the American Trail Products 2" lift. I like the stance and will be looking to upgrade tires as soon as the original Falkens need replacing. I wouldn't pay much mind to what homeboy, arudlang, said. If you want to lift your MP, do it! Throw on the KO2s while you're at it! ...and do it all with a backwards-baseball-cap...that's the only way I drive my Compass. The jeep feels pretty much the same on-road, you just feel a little more like a badass bc you're sitting a little taller.

In terms of off-road, the lift is definitely give you more peace of mind. Comparing my initial off-road trail runs (without the lift) to my more recent ones (with the lift), the lift gives you that extra confidence that you're going to clear rocks and other obstacles that you would otherwise think twice about. And in terms of tires, any upgrade to an all terrain tire is going to automatically increase your off-road capability. Yes, maybe KO2s are a little on the heavy side, but if it's off roading that you're wanting to do, they will definitely be an upgrade from the stock Falkens. So just do you and don't pay attention to the nay-sayers!

If you get a chance, could you please post a pic? Would love to see what it looks like, especially with the 2" kit!

Not so much off roading, but having fun driving through the winter snow. As above mentioned, added Pirelli Scorpion 225/65/17's...Great improvement over the stock Falkens.

So you didn't really notice any major changes in drivability?

Maybe I can wear my baseball cap off to one side, not completely backwards as I have decent tires but no lift! LOL!!!
Don’t mind the Christmas tree on top. But here’s an image of the compass with the ATP 2.0” lift.

And no, I haven’t noticed any changes in drivability. Still enjoy the vehicle but I’m in agreement with everyone that it lacks power. Have you noticed a loss of power when moving up in tire size?
 

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